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M.O.S.S.: Complete Bar-for-Bar Scoring System | Daylyt vs Charlie Clips Full Score


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Old 07-31-2014, 06:48 AM   #81
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Originally Posted by Throwback Mike View Post
Good work. I found it interesting if nothing else. There's flaws in it like any judging system (and it's obviously incredibly tedious), but I might try to apply the system just for fun on a battle or two in the future.
Thanks Mike. In all honesty the transcribing and scoring isn't shit compared to shooting and editing. The next time I want to do one it looks like I'll make a thread here first so you guys can help me with all the lines I miss, maybe we can post scores (at least totals) from multiple people
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:49 AM   #82
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Okay, first I want to say that I plan on making two posts about this. This first one will be as I'm watching the video and getting out some of my thoughts. My second will be about what I think about the concept of this as a whole. I'm going to take my time with this since you put a lot of thought and effort into this video and I really do appreciate that. That's one thing I truly love to see.

For the "Shotgun/Snoop Dogg" line Clips made in the first round, it actually is a double meaning inside of the "scheme (I also hate that term. We always used to reserve schemes for rhyme schemes). Shotgunning is a reference to weed, but I still don't think it was a great line, but the fact he did a double meaning laced in there is interesting. Shotgun is just blowing the smoke in someone's mouth, basically.

LMAO@bear being "fat angry gay man", I'm going to tell my friend that. I didn't know that.

I'm glad you didn't go into the difference between anorexia and bulimia there. That's a line I think people were just being nitpicky about here, especially since a lot of people that are bulimic are ALSO anorexic so you could really just use one word and depending on the context it would be understood.

The stayed in school thing isn't really that bad. You could assume Daylyt was picking his son up early, but he son stayed in school because Daylyt couldn't pick him up. Why couldn't he? Because Charlie Clips split him in half. It's a stretch, I'll admit, but worse things have been said. I'll never say that line is perfect, but it isn't awful or anything.

Eh, different terror is really the same as saying that you're a different type of monster. No big deal.

I hated that Ab-Soul punchline at the end. "Soul leave through your abs" really? REALLY?!

ON TO DAYLYT

"Boo who be on call with texts"- Boo (girl) on call (she'll show up) with texts (all he has to do is text her) AND techs as in he could just call her and she'll show up with a gun. Subtle double meaning. You caught the call/texts/mobile so I won't bother explaining it.

The 2-2 Zone punchline is a sports reference. Basketball I think...or football. Shit, I don't know, I boxed. But like, 2-2 is zone coverage. Pretty sure we're doing basketball here.

Actually, looking back on it six DOES fit. He wasn't just talking about killing Clips, but killing everyone. He kind of set that up with the Smack list, but it wasn't clear. It WAS clear that he meant more than one person though. He'd shoot everyone and leave 6 people dead with two fours. Who do we appreciate? He did just use an arbitrary number though, lol.

Nothing is wrong with "Crew gotta watch ya"

2pac imposters that ain't about that thug life isn't that bad. Wants to be a gangsta because 2pac did it, but really never lived that shit. Just doing it because they think they're cool. Not that bad.

The i90 thing, which I am so glad you looked up because I had no idea and wasn't going to bother, fits as eye. If you look wrong I will shoot you in your eye 90 times. Shit, you know what was an i90? The Chirp. Just a regular punchline. Oh you covered it, lol okay nevermind. Like I said I'm typing this up and watching at the same time and just pausing it a lot. I'm going to split this up in 4 posts actually, 1 post per round and then my assessment of it all.

Like the perk is a reference to percocets, but I don't think people crush those. Dumb people might, but as far as I know you get a better high from just taking them normally (pills). A reach.

Dyke berserk is stupid. But a dyke is just what we call butch lesbians, with nigga being man, so fake nigga. Double meaning from fake nigga. But who the hell says dyke "berserk"
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:04 AM   #83
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Repped. Seriously, that is possibly the most accurate/ real thing anyone has said on here. If we are going to allow people to express themselves fully, then we can't try and turn the whole art into a series of boxes that have to be ticked.
I think you're missing the point of the video. It's not to tick boxes, it's to score rhymes instead of rounds. If you don't like it that's cool, of course not everyone is going to, but my objective here was not to say everyone should have to do this with every battle.

My objective was for people to watch this and realize a little bit that a battle's story is told in the actual rhymes, not who edged which round, which is far too commonly passed off as a recap now.
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:10 AM   #84
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Thanks Mike. In all honesty the transcribing and scoring isn't shit compared to shooting and editing. The next time I want to do one it looks like I'll make a thread here first so you guys can help me with all the lines I miss, maybe we can post scores (at least totals) from multiple people
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this is like the KKK doing a track with 2PAC's Mom.
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:19 AM   #85
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for the record, I don't believe bears of the gay variety have to be angry. In fact if they're gay, hairy, AND jolly....still a bear....

I think...I mean...I have no idea. How would I know anything about this? Stop asking so many questions. I'm not on trial here!
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:22 AM   #86
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I think you're missing the point of the video. It's not to tick boxes, it's to score rhymes instead of rounds. If you don't like it that's cool, of course not everyone is going to, but my objective here was not to say everyone should have to do this with every battle.

My objective was for people to watch this and realize a little bit that a battle's story is told in the actual rhymes, not who edged which round, which is far too commonly passed off as a recap now.
i actually like a lot about what you tried to do and a lot of the points you made about writing and schemes and all that....but its a huge pet peeve of mine when people discount delivery, which this system definitely does.
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:22 AM   #87
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In the second round he was speaking Spanish so- oh shit you're right. There isn't an 8, wtf lmao. There is a n .38, but just an 8? Come on clips...

This is making me realize why I didn't actually like this battle. It's like I saw this intuitively, but didn't care enough to break it all down so I couldn't pinpoint exactly how many reaches there were. I liked Daylyt's first round, but after that I kind of didn't care anymore. Moving on..

Oh, since you don't know DBZ "Imagine boo" is also "Majin Buu" but it is a reach and doesn't really affect Daylyt. It doesn't make the bar much better, but it is just something to know.

In DBZ all of the sayians (Gohan, Goku, Vegeta...you don't care about this) can turn into apes under the full moon as long as their tales have not been removed. LMAO@the Cell/Freeza line.

And no, there is no "one" in a gun lmao. I figured he meant one as in single or the gun he owns but he said "the one" and not "this one" so there goes that. I figured he just fucked up. But yeah, the lowest caliber for a gun is a .22. I THINK the biggest is a .50 (9mm and the such work under a different measurement), but I'm not sure.

ON TO DAYLYT

I really thought one k was one kilo of <insert drugs here>, but the price is way off. No one really says k for kill, but I guess you COULD. Even that is a bit off though, but for something like that you can make up whatever price you want. I really don't like anything from this segment at all. To each his own...

I'm glad Daylyt acknowledged that his Fantastic Four wordplay was a stretch.

Who the fuck is Fred the God Son?

I didn't like this round at all.
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:32 AM   #88
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i actually like a lot about what you tried to do and a lot of the points you made about writing and schemes and all that....but its a huge pet peeve of mine when people discount delivery, which this system definitely does.
Well it's also like you said, completely preference-based. You can score however heavily on whichever elements you like
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:34 AM   #89
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@Flamazide fucker I knew there had to be an extra dbz character in there. I thought there might be a "Katell" where he said "she c' tell" or some shit
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:58 AM   #90
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In Daylyt's third, the whole taking the west thing meant that no one was paying attention to them. They were relatively small. Inches. Then they got bigger because of him and became feet. Now, the fucked up part is "A foot every yard..." That...You're a smart guy, I don't need explain why this is stupid. Actually, maybe we're both wrong and it means something else. I will say that ruler/ruler is a double meaning which leads me to think that it may not be as dumb as it sounds.

WOW YOU DIDN'T GET THE LUTHER PUNCHLINE?!

...I didn't get the power rangers line.

Amazing how I just stopped giving a fuck in the third. I just decided to only comment if you missed a line to help you. But god, this was such an overrated battle to me. The first was good, but after that it just fell apart.
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:11 AM   #91
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OKAY FINISHED THE WHOLE THING!

This is an interesting take on judging, but it isn't exactly viable. Breaking a battle down like this is work. While it adds layers to battling that we didn't really have before in a medium where innovation is hard to find, it is just simply too tedious to really implicate. The video is like 1:30:00 long, longer than the actual battle. That is a chore to watch, let alone do yourself. You had to split this up into multiple days (which shows passion and dedication, I truly am impressed), but something like this is a fucking JOB. There is no way this can be done for multiple battles and not burn anyone out. If you tried you would HATE battles.

Honestly, I don't like any 1-10 point system for rap battles because this a creative work with subjective judging so no matter how hard we try to set up a formula it will ALWAYS be arbitrary. You did your best to attempt to have a set criteria for the writing, but even that is a bit off. Battlers do this to entertain the fans so really can we fault them for having simplistic (and at times non existent) rhyme schemes when the crowd obviously enjoyed it? What, do we say the crowd is wrong for liking what they like? We have to by what they (the battlers) were attempting to do, and that's make the crowd enjoy the battle, which that is what Charlie Clips did live.

These videos are helpful if only to have a breakdown of the lyrics just to appreciate the writing. There were a lot of things Daylyt did in this battle that I didn't catch the first view at all that I'm enlightened by from this video. It is also pretty good for discussion. I find that a lot of people judge battles based on some completely illogical stance they have that they gave no thought to and somehow THAT becomes the consensus of who won. Next thing you know some people don't even want to give their opinion on the battle out of fear of going against the tide. Then you have the fact that not a lot of people want to give a real analysis of the battle and it just turns into "I think rapper x won, WELL I THINK RAPPER Y WON!" with no one explaining themselves at all. I really hate that. I like to understand things...

On to what you said about choking, though... How exactly could you determine how many lines a rapper was supposed to use? Do you go by the time he stopped and how long the battle was supposed to be? Even that doesn't lead to a bar count, even if you have an established pace as the rapper can alter their flow/tempo at any point.

Last edited by Flamazide; 07-31-2014 at 08:19 AM.
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:19 AM   #92
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Thanks a lot for the watch and the lengthy post bro. All valid.

If I did another who do you think would be fun to see dissected
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:19 AM   #93
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@SkippyMacDotCom @Flamazide 1 K = 1 Cake? Maybe, idk...
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:26 AM   #94
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Thanks a lot for the watch and the lengthy post bro. All valid.

If I did another who do you think would be fun to see dissected
Hmmm Loaded Lux vs Hollow would be interesting. Loaded Lux vs Calicoe to see how you handle chokes. And people going well over the time limits...

Illmaculate vs Bigg K

Controversial battles in general.

Dizaster vs Aye Verb seems kind of polarizing.
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:48 AM   #95
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Hmmm Loaded Lux vs Hollow would be interesting. Loaded Lux vs Calicoe to see how you handle chokes. And people going well over the time limits...

Illmaculate vs Bigg K

Controversial battles in general.

Dizaster vs Aye Verb seems kind of polarizing.
Funny - Hollow Lux was originally going to be the first one I did, but at times I find it very hard to count where Lux's bars actually start and end. He does a lot of weird rhythms in acapella battles.

I don't I'd like to score a Hollow battle, anyway. Too many gibberish setups. Just from memory in the Lux battle I know he said:
- "my next style's like a reptile from the x-files"
- "I'll come to a shrine guzzling wine, juggling mines"
- "he can bury a meteor and it won't resurface"

I'd like to do Bigg K and I'd like to do Illmac but their battle is almost a year old now. Maybe the next time one of them two has a real marquee battle. My favorite joint from bola was actually Nitty vs Red.
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Old 07-31-2014, 09:01 AM   #96
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Funny - Hollow Lux was originally going to be the first one I did, but at times I find it very hard to count where Lux's bars actually start and end. He does a lot of weird rhythms in acapella battles.

I don't I'd like to score a Hollow battle, anyway. Too many gibberish setups. Just from memory in the Lux battle I know he said:
- "my next style's like a reptile from the x-files"
- "I'll come to a shrine guzzling wine, juggling mines"
- "he can bury a meteor and it won't resurface"

I'd like to do Bigg K and I'd like to do Illmac but their battle is almost a year old now. Maybe the next time one of them two has a real marquee battle. My favorite joint from bola was actually Nitty vs Red.
Yeah I could see how that would be a problem. Lux is very...unorthodox. Hollow's filler is bad. I think it mostly happens because he freestyles.

My favorite BOLA battle was actually Shuffle-T/Marlo vs Dirtbag Dan/Caustic which I really didn't see coming. I haven't seen Nitty vs O-Red.

MATH HOFFA VS DIZASTER!
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Old 07-31-2014, 05:18 PM   #97
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lol @ trying to judge a battle by reading lyrics off of a screen




















is this 2010?!?!?!
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:28 PM   #98
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"Bar 3-4 - relevant setup to an okay slightly stretched punch; he was there to pick his son up, but then his son stayed in school? 12/20"

He saw his son momentarily as he went to pick him up, to which clips "split day in half" so he couldn't take his son home, therefore he stayed in school, and ironically still got "half-a-day"

No judging system works as angles such as this is based on the readers/listeners ability to understand and interpret.
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:43 PM   #99
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"Bar 3-4 - relevant setup to an okay slightly stretched punch; he was there to pick his son up, but then his son stayed in school? 12/20"

He saw his son momentarily as he went to pick him up, to which clips "split day in half" so he couldn't take his son home, therefore he stayed in school, and ironically still got "half-a-day"

No judging system works as angles such as this is based on the readers/listeners ability to understand and interpret.
tbh

i thought of it as him picking his son up at the normal time (so he stayed all day in school) but he still saw half a day (half of Daylyt)

i'm pretty sure if his dad was literally shot into pieces outside, his son wouldn't be finishing the afternoon in there lol. but if that's what he meant, Clips did phrase it weird.

but yeah, it made sense to me, when i watched it



anyway dope shit, didn't watch the video but read through it all, didn't agree with everything (obviously) but you came to the same judgement over the winner as i did.

would like to see Chilla vs Day done. or Chilla vs Deadman
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:48 PM   #100
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Bar 5 - That was a hard line bro, I like the Perc.


Perc.
Percocet/Oxycodone

If not taken orally, it's crushed down then snorted.
nah it's a Call of Duty line, and he says that was a Hardline Pro actually. Hardline Pro is a perk in COD multiplayer. I don't know what the word Pro is doing in the bar tho
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Old 07-31-2014, 10:38 PM   #101
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"Bar 3-4 - relevant setup to an okay slightly stretched punch; he was there to pick his son up, but then his son stayed in school? 12/20"

He saw his son momentarily as he went to pick him up, to which clips "split day in half" so he couldn't take his son home, therefore he stayed in school, and ironically still got "half-a-day"

No judging system works as angles such as this is based on the readers/listeners ability to understand and interpret.
If he went to pick up his son from school, the whole school day would have already passed, is all. Then according to this line his son would go back to class after seeing his father murdered in front of him. But whatever, it still got a decent score, 12/20 is like those 2 lines getting 6 each. You think it should get more?
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Old 07-31-2014, 10:43 PM   #102
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tbh

i thought of it as him picking his son up at the normal time (so he stayed all day in school) but he still saw half a day (half of Daylyt)

i'm pretty sure if his dad was literally shot into pieces outside, his son wouldn't be finishing the afternoon in there lol. but if that's what he meant, Clips did phrase it weird.

but yeah, it made sense to me, when i watched it



anyway dope shit, didn't watch the video but read through it all, didn't agree with everything (obviously) but you came to the same judgement over the winner as i did.

would like to see Chilla vs Day done. or Chilla vs Deadman
..Should've read this before my last post, this makes sense I guess. Still, I may have misunderstood a bit but I think 12/20 is perfectly fine or even high for that concept and execution.

Yea, I wish I'd done Chilla vs Day instead, I think that was a better battle front to back.
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:12 AM   #103
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he still saw half a day.... meaning charlie clips gun blew daylight in half. half OF day....get it? this isn't that hard lol



wouldn't this system favor guys like B Magic and Bigg K heavily over everyone else ever? maybe this is onto something. hmmmmmmmmmm
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:28 AM   #104
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he still saw half a day.... meaning charlie clips gun blew daylight in half. half OF day....get it? this isn't that hard lol


wouldn't this system favor guys like B Magic and Bigg K heavily over everyone else ever? maybe this is onto something. hmmmmmmmmmm
C'mon Wrist, of course. I missed some shit but "half of Day" is not the problem. The confusion/structural issue is that Clips said Day's son "stayed in school", giving me the impression that he meant after Day was torn in half by gunshots, the son returned to class.
What Rusty pointed out was that he meant to say the son had already stayed in school until the end of the school day. I was confused by it because that's not really the way you would put that, you'd say "his son went to all his classes, but still say half a day", not "he stayed in school", because saying that in a compound sentence with "saw half a day" makes it seem like right after seeing half a day, the son returned to class. Doesn't matter, even if he'd phrased it in a crystal clear way, I'm not that impressed with the line, and nobody's said it was incredible.

And no, it's not necessarily punchline-centric. I have no issue at all giving great scores to setup lines, if they build/maintain crowd anticipation and match, or create context for, the strikes that they set up. I'm just not going to hand out points for generic you bout to get clapped up phrases.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:09 AM   #105
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I don't know if this is a meaningful addition, but I kinda think

"Shoutouts to TDE, cuz ToDay Every shot that hit him..." is at least a little clever and for some reason I think it's intentional... I'd give it a +1 or +2 points for that bar
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:15 AM   #106
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Clips' half a day line is pretty dope you are underestimating..


EVEN THOUGH he stayed in school for a full day (even though his dad was dead), he STILL saw half a day (half his dad)... i'm not saying it's E=MC^2 but you are objectively underestimating it

I appreciate someone taking battle rap seriously... It's obvious that the craft of battle rap is so crazy high in comparison to pretty much everything else on the planet that in 20 years people will be doing college dissertations on this shit in English Lit etc...

So I really enjoy this... Thx for your work.. I do video stuff too so I know the shooting/editing is a LOT of work like A LOT A LOT A LOT and you did a good job with it so I know it probably took forever...

If there was a battle I would want to see this done to next personally, it would be Bigg K vs Illmac ... Might be a little too old for you to have interest in doing it, but that's my vote... In terms of recent battles or if we are also trying to market what you're doing, you should probably do Math vs Diz...

If you can manage to keep this up, I would probably watch all of these like I do the DBD show
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:20 AM   #107
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there is something irritating about a textcee criticizing emcees who have performed in front of 1000s of people...

nothing against textcees, but come one....
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:21 AM   #108
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Omg thx for the flo' fly breakdown... Holy shit i slept on that line so hard that is craaaaaazy pen game whoooooooooaaa imma go trip out on that shittttt
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:23 AM   #109
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C'mon Wrist, of course. I missed some shit but "half of Day" is not the problem. The confusion/structural issue is that Clips said Day's son "stayed in school", giving me the impression that he meant after Day was torn in half by gunshots, the son returned to class.
What Rusty pointed out was that he meant to say the son had already stayed in school until the end of the school day. I was confused by it because that's not really the way you would put that, you'd say "his son went to all his classes, but still say half a day", not "he stayed in school", because saying that in a compound sentence with "saw half a day" makes it seem like right after seeing half a day, the son returned to class. Doesn't matter, even if he'd phrased it in a crystal clear way, I'm not that impressed with the line, and nobody's said it was incredible.

And no, it's not necessarily punchline-centric. I have no issue at all giving great scores to setup lines, if they build/maintain crowd anticipation and match, or create context for, the strikes that they set up. I'm just not going to hand out points for generic you bout to get clapped up phrases.
jesus...enjoy the damn battle and, if it tickles ur fancy, go on your gut feeling. youre really going to talk about compound sentences with two street rappers...
...there is a reason URL is more popular than iAmatextcee.com

performance/delivery

writing is a skill, of course. but this arrogance is mind-boggling.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:26 AM   #110
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didnt watch when i saw dudes face
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:29 AM   #111
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If he went to pick up his son from school, the whole school day would have already passed, is all. Then according to this line his son would go back to class after seeing his father murdered in front of him. But whatever, it still got a decent score, 12/20 is like those 2 lines getting 6 each. You think it should get more?
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:33 AM   #112
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there is something irritating about a textcee criticizing emcees who have performed in front of 1000s of people...

nothing against textcees, but come one....
i wasn't aware of this factor. this changes everything
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:35 AM   #113
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come on
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:40 AM   #114
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i wasn't aware of this factor. this changes everything
u mad bruh?
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:41 AM   #115
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u mad bruh?
no
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:44 AM   #116
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no
colon mad colon

colon

how are you, sir? it is late at night...or early depending on the way you look it...yet i got my REM sleep.

but does this thread irritate you as well?

this is not a transcript battle... delivery is 75% of battle rap.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:49 AM   #117
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no
oh thnks for the rep...thought u were being sarcastic

cheers m8

/not from england or ireland
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:51 AM   #118
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:57 AM   #119
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oh thnks for the rep...thought u were being sarcastic

cheers m8

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haha. I am a lot....so.....understandable ...i live to confuse
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Old 08-01-2014, 08:00 AM   #120
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colon mad colon

colon

how are you, sir? it is late at night...or early depending on the way you look it...yet i got my REM sleep.

but does this thread irritate you as well?

this is not a transcript battle... delivery is 75% of battle rap.
I'm ok. it IS late at night! I work overnights so.....sometimes I kill time on here whilst doing so. Its really the only time I'm on here haha..

and yea I agree. My biggest gripe with it is the fact delivery is impossible to account for with this method.

and it just feels so removed from battle rap in general.....like in the freestyle era this scoring system would be downright silly. of course people are gonna come up with some stupid filler in that era....I mean....I feel like every era it just comes down to, who's raps did you like better?

like I refuse to even do round by round scoring personally. Someone could win the first 2 rounds, but if the 3rd is such a haymaker that it made me forget everything else, I'm going with that person. Quantifying art to this degree in general is a horrible idea
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